Marygrove halting undergrad programs

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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby titanmike » Thu Aug 10, 2017 10:03 am

Tacitus651 wrote:I like our odds of winning this game!

In all seriousness, I'm not shocked Marygrove is gripping with the reality of extreme financial problems. I am shocked they'd make such an announcement in early August. That's a huge disservice to their students, as they will panic to apply to schools and find housing in only a matter of weeks. I get that Marygrove is still offering fall classes, giving the kids a semester, and I get the board just finally agreed to this. But what an awful and $#i!!y thing to do to a bunch of young people. And I'll say this experiment of offering only graduate programs lasts at best a few years.

The joke about Detroit Mercy Marygrove aside, I could see positives of a merger someday. I'll leave out the issue of what the name of the new institution would be, but if UDM could grow enrollment and the neighborhood could improve, anyone with an imagination could see the possibilities. Of course, we don't really know what's under the hood at Marygrove. I've never been there, but I wouldn't be surprised if their buildings are falling apart and they're holding a ton of debt.


I would like to think that the positives of a merger would be, we change the name back to University of Detroit. :roll: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby TitanVoiceofReason » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:05 pm

In this Detroit News story there is no mention of UDM reaching out to Marygrove students. Wayne State and Spring Arbor are taking action. I hope UDM aggressively pursues this opportunity.

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/detroit-city/2017/08/10/marygrove-students-offered-assistance/104468456/
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby Commissioner » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:51 pm

TitanVoiceofReason wrote:In this Detroit News story there is no mention of UDM reaching out to Marygrove students. Wayne State and Spring Arbor are taking action. I hope UDM aggressively pursues this opportunity.

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/detroit-city/2017/08/10/marygrove-students-offered-assistance/104468456/

The 75th percentile ACT for Marygrove undergrads is 19. The 25th percentile ACT score for Detroit Mercy undergrads is 22. I doubt that Marygrove has many undergrad students that Detroit Mercy would want.
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby dennycrane » Thu Aug 10, 2017 10:08 pm

You may very well be correct in what you say, Commissioner, but, in my opinion, we are remiss if our University doesn't take a good look at prospective students from The Grave. Obviously, location is not a deterrent for these students, many may live at home and UDM is quite possibly a natural fit. If Spring Arbor is shopping, we should be too.
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby Motor City Sam » Fri Aug 11, 2017 1:00 pm

dennycrane wrote:You may very well be correct in what you say, Commissioner, but, in my opinion, we are remiss if our University doesn't take a good look at prospective students from The Grave. Obviously, location is not a deterrent for these students, many may live at home and UDM is quite possibly a natural fit. If Spring Arbor is shopping, we should be too.


Agreed. You have a group of students already attending a Catholic University in the area. It would be a mistake not to make overtures to that student body and seek out those qualified. Streamline the application process, hold informational meetings, provide web resources, make counselors and admissions personnel available.
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby uofdmik2008 » Fri Aug 11, 2017 1:42 pm

Motor City Sam wrote:
dennycrane wrote:You may very well be correct in what you say, Commissioner, but, in my opinion, we are remiss if our University doesn't take a good look at prospective students from The Grave. Obviously, location is not a deterrent for these students, many may live at home and UDM is quite possibly a natural fit. If Spring Arbor is shopping, we should be too.


Agreed. You have a group of students already attending a Catholic University in the area. It would be a mistake not to make overtures to that student body and seek out those qualified. Streamline the application process, hold informational meetings, provide web resources, make counselors and admissions personnel available.


The following is a message from the University of Detroit Mercy Facebook page:

Given the situation with Marygrove’s undergraduate program, Detroit Mercy wants to help Marygrove students considering transfer options. Detroit Mercy has put together a transfer guide for general courses. In addition, staff from our Office of Admissions and Office of Financial Aid are available to meet with Marygrove students by appointment or walk-in. Detroit Mercy is evaluating transcripts on an individual basis and eligibility for admissions. Staff are providing individual attention given the current circumstance in order to help students enroll quickly for the fall semester. Future plans may include holding informational sessions and extended office hours based on need to accommodate day and evening appointments. For more information, please call 800-635-5020 or email admissions@udmercy.edu.

An email from President Garibaldi was sent out to faculty an hour after the news broke about the undergrad program at Marygrove that the University was working with the Marygrove Admin to figure out the best way for our institution to assist them and their students during this transition!
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby Motor City Sam » Fri Aug 11, 2017 1:46 pm

uofdmik2008 wrote:
Motor City Sam wrote:
dennycrane wrote:You may very well be correct in what you say, Commissioner, but, in my opinion, we are remiss if our University doesn't take a good look at prospective students from The Grave. Obviously, location is not a deterrent for these students, many may live at home and UDM is quite possibly a natural fit. If Spring Arbor is shopping, we should be too.


Agreed. You have a group of students already attending a Catholic University in the area. It would be a mistake not to make overtures to that student body and seek out those qualified. Streamline the application process, hold informational meetings, provide web resources, make counselors and admissions personnel available.


The following is a message from the University of Detroit Mercy Facebook page:

Given the situation with Marygrove’s undergraduate program, Detroit Mercy wants to help Marygrove students considering transfer options. Detroit Mercy has put together a transfer guide for general courses. In addition, staff from our Office of Admissions and Office of Financial Aid are available to meet with Marygrove students by appointment or walk-in. Detroit Mercy is evaluating transcripts on an individual basis and eligibility for admissions. Staff are providing individual attention given the current circumstance in order to help students enroll quickly for the fall semester. Future plans may include holding informational sessions and extended office hours based on need to accommodate day and evening appointments. For more information, please call 800-635-5020 or email admissions@udmercy.edu.

An email from President Garibaldi was sent out to faculty an hour after the news broke about the undergrad program at Marygrove that the University was working with the Marygrove Admin to figure out the best way for our institution to assist them and their students during this transition!


Excellent news. Thanks for posting that. I will share it on my Facebook page.
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby TitanVoiceofReason » Fri Aug 11, 2017 2:29 pm

uofdmik2008 - thank you for sharing that with us. I thought we would reach out to those students but when a news story appears and our school, being a fellow Catholic institution is not mentioned as one of the schools providing help in transferring it gets one thinking.

Because we are a Catholic university do you think Marygrove will offer its students financial aid to transfer to either UDM or Madonna?
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby NC Titan » Fri Aug 11, 2017 2:47 pm

Trust me, this is not happening in a vacuum.

Dr. G was working with the president of Marygrove before the story broke. But it wasn't our story to break, so we haven't been making a lot of noise like Wayne State and some others. I expect our plan is more internal to Marygrove than many / most other schools'.

Another thing to remember, by the way, is that we have a lot of complementary programs with Marygrove, and we might not be attractive to all the displaced students because we don't have their majors. Dance, for instance.
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby MooseGuy1 » Fri Aug 11, 2017 10:18 pm

So, I guess this means I will not be getting my Dance degree at L6. Mac, you hear this? No Dance for us.
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby uofdmik2008 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 8:20 am

I'm ok if we don't offer a dance degree as long as we go to the dance in March!
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby StJoeUofD » Sat Aug 12, 2017 1:52 pm

Great one, mik!
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby StJoeUofD » Sat Aug 12, 2017 1:58 pm

Hey, on second thought, we should probably add dance and make the basketball players take it. When I was a kid in South Bend, Indiana area, I used to take dance lessons with a guy who turned out to be a pretty good basketball player for UCLA, Mike Warren. He was awesome at ballet, but I admired his basketball skills a bit more. He ended up being an actor with credits like Hill Street Blues. So, the dancing might have given him the agility to be an All-American, but then again, it might be that he was passing the ball to a guy named Lew Alcindor.
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby Tacitus651 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 2:42 pm

Damn, South Bend sure has changed.
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby StJoeUofD » Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:44 pm

It sure has. The dance studio was down by the old South Shore train station that was across from the Colfax Hotel. I think it was called the Marie Bukowski School of Dance, but it has been over 50 years, so I might have that wrong. I used to ride the South Shore from Hudson Lake to So. Bend just to take those lessons. Never did learn how to dance, so I went to U of D so the Jesuits could straighten me out. That worked!
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby Tacitus651 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 5:42 pm

Interesting. I take the South Shore to Chicago sometimes. I guess they're trying to get federal money to speed it up. The time zone change makes it a rough travel day.

I see a lot of similarities between SB and Detroit. Urban decay from shut down automakers basically.
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby uofdfan1983 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 8:29 pm

South Bend and Detroit are both industrial Midwest Cities that have seen lots of urban decay (of course you could say that about Milwaukee, Toledo, Flint.......etc etc).
The difference I find interesting (sad) is that ND is not affected by the difficulties of SB as we are in our city. Why is that? Years ago a good friend who was attending ND at the time took me to a couple ND football games and I spent the weekend both times. Stayin in the dorms, it gives you a chance to talk to some of the students. ND students come from all over the country, and world. I remember asking a few of them who came a long way to go to ND, "why did you choose to come to South Bend." Their answer was basically that ND is ND. It could have been in Peoria, Wapakoneta, Billings...they were choosing ND, not the city it's in. Why does that attitude not carry over for our Catholic Institution, which also carries a boatload of history?...
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby Tacitus651 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:10 pm

Cool points, Tom. I've been at ND 4 years come fall. Why is UDM not ND? I'd say:

ND was founded in 1842 and was one of the first catholic schools in the country. Well after the 1789 at G'Town and a couple others, but still VERY early. To your point, tradition matters. ND has amazing traditions. I can't name them all here, but there's just some phenomenal stories. And as a UDM alum, I don't think we are in their league when it comes to that stuff.

Leadership. ND's charter states the president will always be a Holy Cross Priest. And they've had good ones. Some VERY good ones. ND was always a school for the emerging catholic families with money. But it wasn't always a GREAT university academically. It was a good university with a beautiful campus and tough football team. If you go back and look at university rankings in the 20th century, ND was far from the best catholic school. Georgetown, Marquette, BC, and Santa Clara were killling it in the early 20th century. Then in 1952, a guy named Ted Hesburgh becomes president of ND. He's now referred to as the 2nd founder of ND. He went on a 35 year run as president and put ND in a time machine to the top. Recruited top students, recruited top faculty and deans, fired anyone not great, raised a ton of money and was smart enough to put most of it in an endowment. Hesburgh engaged presidents and world leaders, helped start the peace corps, and he publicized the hell of of ND. I'm convinced if Hesburgh never led ND, it would be ranked maybe 85 in US news and be floating between Marquette and Loyola. Hesburgh's autobiography tells the complete story.

Since then, I guess success breeds success. Once you have a beautiful campus, 10B endowment, tradition, winning programs, national brand, the machine just keeps operating in many ways. Not to say anyone is content. Believe me, at ND the story is always "why aren't we competing with Stanford?!"
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby MooseGuy1 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:25 pm

Good question, Tom. It could be we're comparing kumquats to watermelons. ND has something like a 10 billion dollar endowment. Admittedly, I know little about the subject, but a massive operating budget just makes getting things done easier. Such as attracting students, offering amenities, marketing the brand, and such. Still, different potential enrollees are looking for different things in their college experience. Some look for a more personal experience; others, a massive campus with a wider range of offered majors and the attendant attractions. I tend to value the intimate education offered by a small private institution...not that that matters.

Or, as Tacitus states above (without his usual employment of aphorisms ;) ) success breeds success.

If someone could educate me in the intricacies of endowments and how they shape the student experience, I'm eager to learn.
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Re: Marygrove halting undergrad programs

Postby dennycrane » Sat Aug 12, 2017 11:30 pm

Some of your best work there, tacitus, It's a sensible, credible explanation and you didn't mentioning branding even once.

Now, a question for St. Joe: I remember Mike Warren playing at UCLA with Lew. Was he an All American? It seems like the better known player at the guard position was Henry Bibby. And speaking of UCLA, a couple of us are planning to take the trip for the December 3rd game there. Anyone else thinking of going? Pauley Pavilion should have a wealth of history within it's corridors. A major renovation was completed around 2013 as well. The building was closed for the entire '11 -'12 season, I believe.
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