Corey Allen Transferring

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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby TitanTarHeel » Thu Mar 22, 2018 9:38 am

JimmyChitwood wrote:I hope Vowels is reading this, but I doubt it. The above comments are coming from Titan loyalists, for the most part. The people who don't often complain and always support the program. This is serious.

BA MUST GO NOW! PLEASE!!!

BA is on his 2018 Excuses Tour, meeting with alumni/fans giving them all the excuses why his teams suck (injuries, bad apples, not buying into the system, misunderstandings, immaturity, not enough talent, ball hogs, assistant coaches, towel boys, the sun was in his eyes, etc.) Excuses are unacceptable. Take the blame . . . and leave. Go put your chips on someone else's shoulders. You are not college head coach material and may never be. Nothing personal, but I have been invested in this program my whole life and you are destroying my investment.

I highly doubt those coaches that didn't turn their programs around until years 3 or 4 lost their best players, weren't bringing in better replacements, and wanted to get rid of all of their assistant coaches and start back at ground zero in year 3. I bet they were building a base. BA has no foundation.


+100 to Chit. He nails every point here.

Most indicting to BA is the comment that this thread is full of Titan loyalists who have seen enough and are discouraged about the program's direction. It's been a slide downhill since BA took over, and just when I thought a bottom would be found, here we are losing another all-conference caliber player (I say another because we couldn't keep Hogan eligible this year).

Program is a disaster right now. Calihan will be a morgue next season, sad to realize this already when the 2017-18 season still has 2 weeks to go in it!

**EDITED to add: Good luck to you Corey! You are a real talent, and we were lucky to have you as a Titan.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby udballer » Thu Mar 22, 2018 10:41 am

This is absolutely terrible news, to state the obvious. Best of luck to Corey as he moves forward and I'm hoping he lands in a functional organization that can properly put his talents to use. As an Ohio State fan, I'd gladly take him on that squad as I think he'd fill in nicely for Kam Williams who is an outgoing senior.

So far, to me, it looks like we are losing more than we are gaining next season. It could get ugly... like less than 8 wins ugly, which is tough to do.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby Tacitus651 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 11:47 am

On March 19th, Corey tweeted "Mfs be mad for doing what’s best for u"

I'm guessing that's the day he informed BA he was taking his talents AWAY from 6 Mile.

I don't blame him for leaving. Heck, I would have advised him to leave. He signed up to play under Ray on what looked like a promising team. Instead he got ... well, enough has been said. Good luck to Corey Allen wherever he goes. I don't see how Vowels is still employed by UDM. I suspect it's because, as someone has noted, Garibaldi considers Vowels a good friend. This is no way to run a university. Friends get hired and do poor work no consequences. Coaches' kids play instead of all conference players.

As far as wins next season, we might lay a goose egg.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby udballer » Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:19 pm

I think the odds just went up that JJJ becomes the leading scorer in Titans history at the conclusion of his career.

I just fired an email to Scoonie Penn at Ohio State regarding the transfer announcement. Let's see if tOSU is as good at responding to people as Detroit Mercy has been over the years.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby Commissioner » Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:06 pm

Tacitus651 wrote:On March 19th, Corey tweeted "Mfs be mad for doing what’s best for u"

I'm guessing that's the day he informed BA he was taking his talents AWAY from 6 Mile.

I don't blame him for leaving. Heck, I would have advised him to leave. He signed up to play under Ray on what looked like a promising team. Instead he got ... well, enough has been said. Good luck to Corey Allen wherever he goes. I don't see how Vowels is still employed by UDM. I suspect it's because, as someone has noted, Garibaldi considers Vowels a good friend. This is no way to run a university. Friends get hired and do poor work no consequences. Coaches' kids play instead of all conference players.

As far as wins next season, we might lay a goose egg.

Whoa, boy. I don't think anybody ever said Garibaldi considers Vowels "a good friend." Happy to admit I'm wrong if you find that post. I know Tom did say that they are "friends," and that is quite a bit different. I am "friends" with most of my subordinates, colleagues, and superiors. I like them and enjoy working with them. That's a FAR cry from suggesting that my superiors will ignore more flaws or I'll ignore the flaws of my subordinates. You make it sound like this is the next thing to nepotism, and I don't think that there is evidence that that is there. Indeed, if memory serves, in that same post Tom said that Garibaldi wouldn't hesitate to fire Vowels despite their being friends. I don't think he ever said "close friends" or "good friends" or anything like that. That's you, turning one passing comment into some kind of big conspiracy thinking deal.

The real "friend" problem, I think, came in hiring Bacari. Bacari was a "friend" of UofD. He really wanted not just a head coaching job but the Titan job. And we really wanted to like him. There are two reasons I'm never big on inviting the old stars back to coach the alma mater in hopes of recapturing lost glory. One is that it almost always ends in disappointment, almost by definition--because with rare exceptions, most coaches end up getting fired. The other may make the one I just discussed more likely--everyone tends to be too emotionally invested in the candidate and doesn't look at the candidate objectively enough. We all especially wanted to like Bacari. People like the idea of a "true Titan" returning to coach, someone who presumably isn't just using the university as a stepping stone, or just a retread looking for any job. But we know that Bacari was passed over for other top jobs (I don't know how many he actually tried for, but he was reported as a candidate at Green Bay, at EMU, and some others--but sometimes those are just rumors and wish lists). Maybe he just didn't seem like as good a fit at Green Bay, but maybe also, they just had a bit more skeptical eye.

So, whenever Bacari goes, let's NOT hire a UofD man.

But my original point here is simple--there's lots of reasons to be upset with the tenure of Bacari as HC and Vowels as AD. It's not necessary to start making stuff up by elaborating on one off-hand comment about the relationship between the Prez and the AD. If I'm wrong, link to the post.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby The-Dude » Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:15 pm

From my recollection, I’m in agreement with Commish.

The real tragedy and indictment on BA is that CA did not transfer. It’s that he sinply left. This speaks to me and leaves me gutted.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby Tacitus651 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 2:55 pm

Commissioner, I won't link the post because you cited the correct one. Tom said they were friends, and I, admittedly, embellished and added "good" in front of it. But, like Tom went on to say, Garibaldi will not hesitate to do what it takes. Well, that time is now. Can ANYONE give any argument based in reality that Vowels should not be fired immediately? I suppose the best argument would be that an immediate departure could cause some internal havoc and perhaps we run into a backlog of reporting requirements to the NCAA. Those are real concerns, but they don't outweigh the complete embarrassment of having Vowels on staff considering the train wreck he has created.

I'd submit that if Garibaldi does not dismiss Vowels within the next few weeks, one of two things must be true. One, Garibaldi has become too good of friends with Vowels and he's being irresponsible by not firing him due to friendship. Or, two, Garibaldi is not accurately analyzing this situation at all.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby NC Titan » Thu Mar 22, 2018 3:05 pm

"Must" be true? I'd say there could be other reasons.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby Tacitus651 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 3:17 pm

NC Titan wrote:"Must" be true? I'd say there could be other reasons.


Ok, name them.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby Rogobob77 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 4:47 pm

Tacitus651 wrote:
NC Titan wrote:"Must" be true? I'd say there could be other reasons.


Ok, name them.

Don’t know if this is necessarily true, but perhaps RV has communicated that he is actively looking for other opportunities and is likely to leave on his own volition in the near future, the school might just let that scenario play out.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby NC Titan » Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:02 pm

Tacitus651 wrote:Ok, name them.


In my education at UofD I learned that there are almost no absolutes. Saying there are only two possible explanations for something in the future occurring (or not occurring) is, well, ignorant. Rogo gave a third plausible explanation. Board involvement to make a decision (i.e. not a Garibaldi decision) is another. Keeping RV as the result of an accurate analysis (i.e. you're uninformed or just plain wrong) is another possibility.

Your logical errors, Tacitus, are making it a binary decision ("one of two things must be true") and then deciding that you alone can determine the two options.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby Tacitus651 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:26 pm

Rogo's explanation is really just a subset of option number one that I provided. Vowels says he's looking to leave, so UDM pays him to explore opportunities. Wow, that would be great leadership. I get that this is a common thing in higher ed, but not when performance is THIS bad.

Your explanation, NC, is just a subset of option number two that I provided. If Garibaldi can't explain and convince the trustees to let him fire Vowels in the next few weeks then he's NOT understanding just how bad this situation is.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby Rogobob77 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:59 pm

Tacitus651 wrote:Rogo's explanation is really just a subset of option number one that I provided. Vowels says he's looking to leave, so UDM pays him to explore opportunities. Wow, that would be great leadership. I get that this is a common thing in higher ed, but not when performance is THIS bad.

Your explanation, NC, is just a subset of option number two that I provided. If Garibaldi can't explain and convince the trustees to let him fire Vowels in the next few weeks then he's NOT understanding just how bad this situation is.

FWIW, if BA and/or RV are terminated prior to the expiration of their current contracts, the University is for all practical purposes paying them for a period of time where one/both are completely free to explore other employment opportunities, something you suggest would be a demonstration of poor leadership by AG.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby Tacitus651 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 6:16 pm

Very true for BA, but we are talking about RV. You can't say for certain that RV is not past the point in his contract where AG has the option to dismiss without any required future payments (unless you work for the university and have seen the contract).

Even if the university would owe RV the remainder of any contract, every day RV still reports to work costs us the opportunity cost of not publicly searching for a competent AD.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby StJoeUofD » Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:53 pm

For the health of an organism or an organization, you cut out the cancer as soon as you can recognize it.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby udballer » Thu Mar 22, 2018 9:13 pm

StJoeUofD wrote:For the health of an organism or an organization, you cut out the cancer as soon as you can recognize it.


I'm sure BA will offer up Corey as the cancer if it comes to trying to save his job.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby MooseGuy1 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 9:36 pm

I was for giving BA another year but I've hit critical moose. Our program may very well be in the worst shape of any D-1 team in the country and I'm more than disappointed. This is a mess of epic proportion and people need to be shown the door. Drastic changes need to be done and fast or all of us will lose something that means a lot. At some point (and we're at that point), you have to make some decisions that may be costly in the short run but necessary.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby bctitans1987 » Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:31 am

Vowels isn't going anywhere. Garibaldi doesn't fire anyone. Half the people at UDM have been there for 25+ years and simply mail-it-in everyday. They get their nice pensions and know they won't get fired. The place is a complete joke. JJ will remain as well because Vowels lacks leadership and balls. He's a corporate lackie. Christ, he worked for the NCAA!

Let's be clear: The Mercy Nuns and Jesuits are to blame. They lack leadership and foresight. There is a simple solution: Stop giving them money and soon it will be another vacant piece of property in that well-run city. The corrupt deserve each other.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby Big Chuck » Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:53 am

bctitans1987 wrote:Vowels isn't going anywhere. Garibaldi doesn't fire anyone. Half the people at UDM have been there for 25+ years and simply mail-it-in everyday. They get their nice pensions and know they won't get fired. The place is a complete joke. JJ will remain as well because Vowels lacks leadership and balls. He's a corporate lackie. Christ, he worked for the NCAA!

Let's be clear: The Mercy Nuns and Jesuits are to blame. They lack leadership and foresight. There is a simple solution: Stop giving them money and soon it will be another vacant piece of property in that well-run city. The corrupt deserve each other.


This may be a new low. In a thread about a player transferring we have allegations that Jesuits and Mercy nuns are corrupt.
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Re: Corey Allen Transferring

Postby upbasketballfan » Fri Mar 23, 2018 9:03 am

Big Chuck wrote:
bctitans1987 wrote:Vowels isn't going anywhere. Garibaldi doesn't fire anyone. Half the people at UDM have been there for 25+ years and simply mail-it-in everyday. They get their nice pensions and know they won't get fired. The place is a complete joke. JJ will remain as well because Vowels lacks leadership and balls. He's a corporate lackie. Christ, he worked for the NCAA!

Let's be clear: The Mercy Nuns and Jesuits are to blame. They lack leadership and foresight. There is a simple solution: Stop giving them money and soon it will be another vacant piece of property in that well-run city. The corrupt deserve each other.


This may be a new low. In a thread about a player transferring we have allegations that Jesuits and Mercy nuns are corrupt.


I'm telling you guys, something happens when a poster puts a # behind a sign in!
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