Will the real UDM please stand up?

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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby Tacitus651 » Wed Aug 15, 2018 1:45 pm

Commissioner wrote:
Tacitus651 wrote:I’m clearly not attempting to argue that Detroit Mercy is a better name for the university itself. I don’t think any alum, young or old would suggest that honestly. I am suggesting that athletics should conform to Detroit Mercy so long as the name of the school is such out of pure consistency.


In other words, having made a mistake, by god we should double down on it!


No, doubling down would be keeping the school name Detroit Mercy, which is what G/Trustees decided to do two years ago.

Keeping athletics the same name as the school (no matter how bad or confusing that name is) is just common sense. Not one of the examples people have offered (UM, MSU, Omaha, Milwaukee, blah blah blah) are analogous to what you are proposing. Sure, there are private schools that have more complicated names (Notre Dame du Lac, Duquesne University of the Holy Spirit). But, those schools don't advertise those names to the public as their academic brand - the only place you still see those full names are on 990 tax forms and maybe a few other legal/official documents. Truth is, no one has offered a truly analogous example because one does not exist.
"Anything that can be done in college basketball can be done from right here.” - Coach Davis
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby Rogobob77 » Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:32 pm

All things considered, perhaps renaming the school “Detroit Catholic University” would have been a better compromise in 1990. That name would have succinctly emphasized our urban location and consolidated Jesuit/Mercy Catholic identity. I think the “U of D” and “University of Detroit” references would have quickly faded in such a scenario, something that has proven tough to do when the official name of the institution has been the “University of Detroit Mercy.” Currently, folks want to abbreviate the University name by truncating the “Mercy” or, less frequently, the “University of Detroit,” and/or invoking a slew of other possible alternatives. I wonder if Marygrove College joined as the third school in the consolidation what name would have be selected — my guess, “University of Detroit” or “Detroit Catholic University.” It would be interesting to know if “Detroit Catholic” was ever seriously explored as a brand option a couple years ago by the University’s consultants.
Last edited by Rogobob77 on Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby titanmike » Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:33 pm

StJoeUofD wrote:Although I personally like titanmike's suggestion, this whole matter seems to me to be "much ado about nothing". Anyone who was a U of D fan that isn't a fan of Detroit Mercy probably wasn't a U of D fan in the first place. Anyone who wasn't a U of D fan and has just been introduced to Detroit Mercy doesn't care if our old name was University of Detroit or Mercy College.

I doubt any MSU fan is worried about their naming history.
February 12, 1855 Agricultural College of the State of Michigan
March 15, 1861 State Agricultural College
June 2, 1909 Michigan Agricultural College (M.A.C.)
May 13, 1925[5] Michigan State College of Agriculture and Applied Science (MSC)
July 1, 1955 Michigan State University of Agriculture and Applied Science (MSU)
January 1, 1964 Michigan State University (MSU)

People who follow the Titans will recognize Detroit, UDM or Detroit Mercy. People are playing against us or cheering for whomever is playing against us will forget our name the moment we beat them. All they care about is how good we are vis-a-vis their team. The TV guys only care whether our name is easy to pronounce.

In essence --- who really cares? If we win a lot of games, everyone will know who we are. If we lose a lot of games no one will care and we will spend our time of this forum debating the name and not how many games we are going to need to win to make it the Big Dance.

This is the only team we have.

These guys (and gals for our ladies team) are our team. We love them, we support them, we are sad when they lose and joyous when they win. Call them what you want, I just call them My Team.


Agree to a certain extent which is why I remain a fan and didn't bail in 1990.
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby DetroitBASKETBALL » Wed Aug 15, 2018 4:24 pm

Rogobob77 wrote:All things considered, perhaps renaming the school “Detroit Catholic University” would have been a better compromise in 1990. That name would have succinctly emphasized our urban location and consolidated Jesuit/Mercy Catholic identity. I think the “U of D” and “University of Detroit” references would have quickly faded in such a scenario, something that has proven tough to do when the official name of the institution has been the “University of Detroit Mercy.” Currently, folks want to abbreviate the University name by truncating the “Mercy” or, less frequently, the “University of Detroit,” and/or invoking a slew of other possible alternatives. I wonder if Marygrove College joined as the third school in the consolidation what name would have be selected — my guess, “University of Detroit” or “Detroit Catholic University.” It would be interesting to know if “Detroit Catholic” was ever seriously explored as a brand option a couple years ago by the University’s consultants.


I believe Catholic University of Michigan was proposed but nixed for obvious reasons.
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby DetroitBASKETBALL » Wed Aug 15, 2018 4:31 pm

upbasketballfan wrote:
As someone who is an Alum of neither I would be interested to see who is actually keeping this University afloat since the merger and was it a one time injection of help and then a free ride for eternity by Mercy. The people who I have met over the last 50+ years while attending events at your University describe themselves as U of D Alums I can not remember anyone telling me they are a product of UDM. I run into Mike quite often but have never met DetroitBASKETBALL who seems to be aggressively rude on this issue.


The only programs not having consistent declines are medical, the most profitable in relation to tuition and aid is medical. Yes they have kept us afloat. The little endowment we did have after merger came from Mercy College. The Nursing and Medical programs are the most profitable and are at full enrollment.
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby R.B.J1 » Wed Aug 15, 2018 5:01 pm

I did not attend the University of Detroit, Mercy College or the University of Detroit Mercy, however, I've worked with people who are graduates of Mercy College the University of Detroit and the University of Detroit Mercy. These men are all between the ages of 40-53. All of them say they are graduates of the University of Detroit.
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby DetroitBASKETBALL » Wed Aug 15, 2018 5:06 pm

R.B.J1 wrote:I did not attend the University of Detroit, Mercy College or the University of Detroit Mercy, however, I've worked with people who are graduates of Mercy College the University of Detroit and the University of Detroit Mercy. These men are all between the ages of 40-53. All of them say they are graduates of the University of Detroit.


Fantastic, said it multiple times from marketing sense UofD makes sense, but cannot and will not happen. I have interacted with people that called it UDM but it doesnt mean anything, I would rather call it UofD but it doesnt matter what I want or anyone else wants, the sponsoring orders of the University of Detroit Mercy are the Sisters of Mercy and Jesuits. If enough if us call it UofD maybe as we get further away from merger it will be ok or maybe let's rebrand completely like someone earlier suggested to Catholic University of Detroit.
Last edited by DetroitBASKETBALL on Wed Aug 15, 2018 5:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby 77-85Titan » Wed Aug 15, 2018 5:07 pm

What we have here is Branding 101 and the school flunked. It's got nothing to do with insulting any graduate or subgroup.

Companies (and schools) get branded successfully by leveraging their best name recognition, logos, simplicity and history. Examples are:
The Coca-Cola Bottling Company is COKE
Local law firm Jaffe Raitt Hueur and Weiss is simply JAFFE.
Deloitte Touche Tohmatsu Limited is DELOITTE It's not a slap at Touche or Tohmatsu, it's simplicity and name recognition.
The Air and Space Museum and the Natural History Museum and others are SMITHSONIAN'S
The J. Paul Getty Museum is The GETTY
U-M has the simple BLOCK M LOGO
Michigan State has the simple GREEN SPARTAN HEAD LOGO

In comparison, what do we have?
A multi-worded, multi-letter name (take your pick).
A logo with a sword, a shield, multiple colors, multiple words and general confusion of an M surrounding a D or whatever it is.
We do not use our over 100 year history of University of Detroit or U-D (which is our #1 brand recognition), nor a simple logo (the old lower case scripted d was a simple logo).
Are we Detroit, are we Mercy, are we a University, are we a nursing school, are we a college, do we have any history, simplicity or name recognition with what we currently have?

As I said, it's got nothing to do with insulting someone or not being inclusive, it's Branding and it's not consistent with good business or best practices. It's a mess.
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby DetroitBASKETBALL » Wed Aug 15, 2018 5:16 pm

77-85Titan wrote:What we have here is Branding 101 and the school flunked. It's got nothing to do with insulting any graduate or subgroup.

Companies (and schools) get branded successfully by leveraging their best name recognition, logos, simplicity and history. Examples are:
The Coca-Cola Bottling Company is COKE
Local law firm Jaffe Raitt Hueur and Weiss is simply JAFFE.
Deloitte Touche Tohmatsu Limited is DELOITTE It's not a slap at Touche or Tohmatsu, it's simplicity and name recognition.
The Air and Space Museum and the Natural History Museum and others are SMITHSONIAN'S
The J. Paul Getty Museum is The GETTY
U-M has the simple BLOCK M LOGO
Michigan State has the simple GREEN SPARTAN HEAD LOGO

In comparison, what do we have?
A multi-worded, multi-letter name (take your pick).
A logo with a sword, a shield, multiple colors, multiple words and general confusion of an M surrounding a D or whatever it is.
We do not use our over 100 year history of University of Detroit or U-D (which is our #1 brand recognition), nor a simple logo (the old lower case scripted d was a simple logo).
Are we Detroit, are we Mercy, are we a University, are we a nursing school, are we a college, do we have any history, simplicity or name recognition with what we currently have?

As I said, it's got nothing to do with insulting someone or not being inclusive, it's Branding and it's not consistent with good business or best practices. It's a mess.


You are correct UofD is easier from marketing standpoint as conceded on a dozen other occasions how many of those you mentioned rebranded 2 years ago or did they build that brand over time? How many of those other entities with dropped names continue financially sponsoring those organizations and are 50% stake holders financially in those organizations? Marketing 101 eh? This is a bit more complicated with other stakeholders if we go down your path we lose, go to UofD lose support, go to completely unrelated name lose history of the previous institutions, don't remember this example given by Dr. Bernake in Marketing 101.
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby Tacitus651 » Wed Aug 15, 2018 6:26 pm

From a new recruit:

“Blessed to receive my first offer from Detroit University!”

https://mobile.twitter.com/dontaestringer_
"Anything that can be done in college basketball can be done from right here.” - Coach Davis
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby titanmac » Wed Aug 15, 2018 6:56 pm

hah! great stuff! i respect your views bball. but i wouldnt put you in charge of my marketing department.
In Greek mythology, the Titans were greater even than the gods. They ruled their universe with absolute power! Well that basketball court out there tonight, that's our universe. Let's rule it like Titans! (with apologies to coach boon)
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby DetroitBASKETBALL » Wed Aug 15, 2018 9:25 pm

titanmac wrote:hah! great stuff! i respect your views bball. but i wouldnt put you in charge of my marketing department.

Thanks mac, everyone is entitled to opinion, most have them kind of like assholes, I respect most people's opinion on this board, but most of these opinions are based on garbage intel. Neither this University nor your company could afford me, my view on marketing is in line with everyone else, UofD makes sense from marketing, but I don't know of a single company exec leaving the faith of everything in Marketing. Most good businesses and institutions take all parts of decision into consideration. I am privy to the inside info and can tell you, most of you are too biased and clueless about the real decision making going on in the Fisher Admin Building 2 years ago! I agree the roll out is not good or consistent, but all of you are ignoring a bunch of other reasons for it or just don't know them. Keep your marketing job, I am too good and too well paid at what I do.
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby titanmac » Wed Aug 15, 2018 10:15 pm

thats exactly the point! noone cares about that stuff, good reasons tho they may have. and the “roll out” was doomed from the start. good ceo’s don’t pour water out the window in the face of a driving wind; so to speak....
In Greek mythology, the Titans were greater even than the gods. They ruled their universe with absolute power! Well that basketball court out there tonight, that's our universe. Let's rule it like Titans! (with apologies to coach boon)
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby DetroitBASKETBALL » Wed Aug 15, 2018 10:59 pm

titanmac wrote:thats exactly the point! noone cares about that stuff, good reasons tho they may have. and the “roll out” was doomed from the start. good ceo’s don’t pour water out the window in the face of a driving wind; so to speak....


Good ceos also don't crash the car! That stuff does matter if your marketing decision makes you financially insolvent. No marketing if your institution doesn't exist. No point in having a flashy car if it gets repossessed! Fundamental business sense is very important in a good CEO. I am glad you are not on my executive team as much as I value your opinion. Fyi everything after that decision to remain University of Detroit Mercy has been S*** in the rollout, I think there is plenty of things this school could do to improve grow, including properly leveraging Athletics. No matter what you think you know, there was no way back to UofD if you were even in the same neighborhood of the decision being made you would know that as fact and stop this silliness! By all means keep calling it UofD, eventually if everyone just calls it that maybe we go back to that it demphasize the Mercy, but not any time soon. But you guys should stop talking as if you are on the in or know anything of concrete behind the decision, I will say that I am impressed how many, Administrative, Marketing, Business, Legal, Coaching and recruiting gurus UofD, Mercy College, UDM and Detroit Mercy has produced, damn who needs zip recruiter or LinkedIn, just come to the Detroit Mercy MBB boards, you get all the top talent!
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby upbasketballfan » Wed Aug 15, 2018 11:18 pm

DetroitBASKETBALL wrote:
titanmac wrote:thats exactly the point! noone cares about that stuff, good reasons tho they may have. and the “roll out” was doomed from the start. good ceo’s don’t pour water out the window in the face of a driving wind; so to speak....


Good ceos also don't crash the car! That stuff does matter if your marketing decision makes you financially insolvent. No marketing if your institution doesn't exist. No point in having a flashy car if it gets repossessed! Fundamental business sense is very important in a good CEO. I am glad you are not on my executive team as much as I value your opinion. Fyi everything after that decision to remain University of Detroit Mercy has been S*** in the rollout, I think there is plenty of things this school could do to improve grow, including properly leveraging Athletics. No matter what you think you know, there was no way back to UofD if you were even in the same neighborhood of the decision being made you would know that as fact and stop this silliness! By all means keep calling it UofD, eventually if everyone just calls it that maybe we go back to that it demphasize the Mercy, but not any time soon. But you guys should stop talking as if you are on the in or know anything of concrete behind the decision, I will say that I am impressed how many, Administrative, Marketing, Business, Legal, Coaching and recruiting gurus UofD, Mercy College, UDM and Detroit Mercy has produced, damn who needs zip recruiter or LinkedIn, just come to the Detroit Mercy MBB boards, you get all the top talent!


Yup! That is one of your most intelligent comments so far! Good to see all this talent is not being completely overlooked.
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby titanmac » Thu Aug 16, 2018 12:21 am

:) :) :) :) :)
In Greek mythology, the Titans were greater even than the gods. They ruled their universe with absolute power! Well that basketball court out there tonight, that's our universe. Let's rule it like Titans! (with apologies to coach boon)
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby udballer » Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:20 am

In the past, I worked for a company called Vector SCM. It was the subsidiary of a company called CNF. CNF also owned Menlo Logistics and Con-way Freight. In total, CNF was the parent company to Vector, Menlo and Con-way.

Shortly before I left the company, there was a lot of discussion about consolidating all of the business under a single name... to simplify and strengthen branding. My original assumption, being young & naïve was that we'd consolidate under the 'CNF' moniker... as that was the parent company. However, when it all shook out the one brand left standing was "Con-way". The thought behind this was that although CNF was the parent, nobody had really ever heard of that company. Vector and Menlo were similar stories, being that they were fairly regional and smaller. Con-way, however, was a known entity. People all over the country had undoubtedly seen Con-way trucks driving down their freeways and due to that the brand was recognizable. We didn't want CNF trucks flowing down the freeway and have to hear people explain "Oh, that company is actually Con-way". It seemed to be the logical conclusion to brand the way they did.

I use a similar line of thinking when I agree with others that our school should be known as "University of Detroit" / "UofD" moving forward. We can rebrand as anything we want, but so long as people have ever really heard or care about "UofD"... all that follows is confusion when staying on the path that we are on. We will always require a bystander with knowledge of our history to tell his buddy... "that team over there is the UofD team I was talking about".
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby NC Titan » Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:46 am

I just ran across a reference to UMD: The University of Maryland. It's their official brand.
#DetroitsCollegeTeam #OurCityOurTime
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby DetroitBASKETBALL » Thu Aug 16, 2018 12:00 pm

upbasketballfan wrote:
DetroitBASKETBALL wrote:
titanmac wrote:thats exactly the point! noone cares about that stuff, good reasons tho they may have. and the “roll out” was doomed from the start. good ceo’s don’t pour water out the window in the face of a driving wind; so to speak....


Good ceos also don't crash the car! That stuff does matter if your marketing decision makes you financially insolvent. No marketing if your institution doesn't exist. No point in having a flashy car if it gets repossessed! Fundamental business sense is very important in a good CEO. I am glad you are not on my executive team as much as I value your opinion. Fyi everything after that decision to remain University of Detroit Mercy has been S*** in the rollout, I think there is plenty of things this school could do to improve grow, including properly leveraging Athletics. No matter what you think you know, there was no way back to UofD if you were even in the same neighborhood of the decision being made you would know that as fact and stop this silliness! By all means keep calling it UofD, eventually if everyone just calls it that maybe we go back to that it demphasize the Mercy, but not any time soon. But you guys should stop talking as if you are on the in or know anything of concrete behind the decision, I will say that I am impressed how many, Administrative, Marketing, Business, Legal, Coaching and recruiting gurus UofD, Mercy College, UDM and Detroit Mercy has produced, damn who needs zip recruiter or LinkedIn, just come to the Detroit Mercy MBB boards, you get all the top talent!


Yup! That is one of your most intelligent comments so far! Good to see all this talent is not being completely overlooked.


Thank you, I truly appreciate it, it takes talent to identify talent! 8-)
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Re: Will the real UDM please stand up?

Postby 77-85Titan » Thu Aug 16, 2018 8:03 pm

Looks like the Mormon's are having similar issues.....

https://www.deseretnews.com/article/900 ... -uses.html
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